This is coolbert:
These various You Tube video of silenced sub-machine guns [SMG] most interesting.
Silenced weapons the report of which significantly reduced.
Report of course the "bang" made by the firearm. GO LISTEN!
1. "Suppressed Thompson with Lane Socom 458 Silencer Tommy Gun"
It is reputed that Australian SAS in Vietnam had access to and used on patrol a silenced version of the Thompson SMG, that Aussie response to the weapon most favorable.
2. "Sterling Mk5 Suppressor (L34A1)"
Disregard the commentary in Japanese and concentrate only on the report of the weapon as silenced.
3. "Integrally suppressed full auto Sten build"
A silenced Sten as used effectively during Operation Rimau from the era of the Second World War.
Silenced SMG very useful I might well imagine during special operations type missions.
That degree of advantage as gained in an ambush situation marked?
The adversary less able to return fire with accuracy?
Silenced SMG if equipped with sub-sonic rounds as fired also reducing that report. That too within the purview of special operations almost exclusively so.
coolbert.
Showing posts with label Silencer. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Silencer. Show all posts
Wednesday, March 30, 2016
Saturday, November 15, 2008
QSPR
This is coolbert:
Thanks here to the great Russian web site: WorldGuns.
"Smith & Wesson / AAI Quiet Special Purpose Revolver / QSPR / tunnel revolver (USA)"
This was a new one on me. A revolver, developed by the U.S. Army for use by tunnel rats in Vietnam.
The tunnel rat. An American troop, small in stature but big in courage, venturing into the very heart of the enemy underground. Those tunnel complexes so favored by the communist enemy in Vietnam. Elaborate underground structures that could harbor an entire division of enemy troops if need be.
American tunnel rats, equipped with a bare minimum of equipment, often operating solo, entering the "commie" abode in the search primarily for material of intelligence value.
Again, the tunnel rat, barely equipped, often carrying with intent a minimum of gear. Gear to include:
* Small caliber handgun.
* Goggles.
* Knee-pads and gloves.
* Gas mask.
* Hearing protection.
* Illumination device of some sort.
* Grenades. [concussion, flash/bang grenades were available?]
It should be understood that the .45 ACP auto loading pistol, standard issue to American infantry at the time, WAS TOO LARGE A CALIBER FOR EFFECTIVE USE UNDERGROUND!! The report ["bang" made by detonation of the firearm] and muzzle flash were both deafening and blinding at one and the same time.
It was preferred to use an expedient handgun of smaller caliber during tunnel rat operations. A .38 special revolver or a Chinese made 7.62 auto loading pistol quite often being used in lieu of the .45 ACP weapon, the 7.62 Chicom pistol perhaps having been captured from communist forces prior!
Here is the weapon the U.S. Army devised to fill the need for a potent handgun to be used in tunnel warfare.
The QSPR.

"Quiet Special Purpose Revolver (QSPR; also known as 'tunnel revolver' or 'tunnel gun') evolved from 1967 US Army requirements for a silenced, multi-projectile hand weapon for use by 'tunnel exploration personnel' (so called 'tunnel rats'), which operated against Vietnamese communist forces in the numerous tunnels dug by NVA and VC personnel"
"based on commercially available Smith & Wesson Model 29 .44 Magnum revolvers, rebuilt by AAI to handle their special integrally silenced ammunition. Earliest prototypes featured new, very short smooth bore barrels"
* NO sights. None were needed. Low-light, use at close quarters, etc.
* Stubby, smooth-bore, almost non-existent barrel.
A firearm using uniquely developed INTERNALLY SILENCED AMMUNITION!!
"internally silenced ammunition, based on the "gas seal piston" concept . . . The whole concept of the internally silenced ammunition is rather old and starts in the pre-WW1 era, but practical results were achieved only during 1950s and 1960s, when chemical and metallurgical technologies finally permitted manufacture of actual ammunition."
A handgun NOT firing conventional ammunition. Firing tungsten balls from a sabot round!!
"the QSPR ammunition fired fifteen tungsten balls (loaded into plastic sabot)"
"the practical lethal range was estimated at about 30 feet / 10 meters, which was sufficient for extremely cramped tunnels of Vietnam war. The sound signature [report] of QSPR round fired from QSPR revolver was about 110 dB, or similar to that of traditionally silenced .22LR pistol."
AS WITH MOST, IF NOT ALL, "SILENCED" WEAPONRY, NOT TOTALLY SILENCED, BUT RATHER, MUFFLED!!
Was used to a very limited extent by special operations units in Vietnam, BUT NOT DURING TUNNEL OPERATIONS!!
These handguns, if they still exist, must be worth a lot of money. What happened to them in the aftermath of the war. You could not fire one as the ammo would not be available? Worth something to a collector, that would be for sure!
coolbert.
Thanks here to the great Russian web site: WorldGuns.
"Smith & Wesson / AAI Quiet Special Purpose Revolver / QSPR / tunnel revolver (USA)"
This was a new one on me. A revolver, developed by the U.S. Army for use by tunnel rats in Vietnam.
The tunnel rat. An American troop, small in stature but big in courage, venturing into the very heart of the enemy underground. Those tunnel complexes so favored by the communist enemy in Vietnam. Elaborate underground structures that could harbor an entire division of enemy troops if need be.
American tunnel rats, equipped with a bare minimum of equipment, often operating solo, entering the "commie" abode in the search primarily for material of intelligence value.
Again, the tunnel rat, barely equipped, often carrying with intent a minimum of gear. Gear to include:
* Small caliber handgun.
* Goggles.
* Knee-pads and gloves.
* Gas mask.
* Hearing protection.
* Illumination device of some sort.
* Grenades. [concussion, flash/bang grenades were available?]
It should be understood that the .45 ACP auto loading pistol, standard issue to American infantry at the time, WAS TOO LARGE A CALIBER FOR EFFECTIVE USE UNDERGROUND!! The report ["bang" made by detonation of the firearm] and muzzle flash were both deafening and blinding at one and the same time.
It was preferred to use an expedient handgun of smaller caliber during tunnel rat operations. A .38 special revolver or a Chinese made 7.62 auto loading pistol quite often being used in lieu of the .45 ACP weapon, the 7.62 Chicom pistol perhaps having been captured from communist forces prior!
Here is the weapon the U.S. Army devised to fill the need for a potent handgun to be used in tunnel warfare.
The QSPR.

"Quiet Special Purpose Revolver (QSPR; also known as 'tunnel revolver' or 'tunnel gun') evolved from 1967 US Army requirements for a silenced, multi-projectile hand weapon for use by 'tunnel exploration personnel' (so called 'tunnel rats'), which operated against Vietnamese communist forces in the numerous tunnels dug by NVA and VC personnel"
"based on commercially available Smith & Wesson Model 29 .44 Magnum revolvers, rebuilt by AAI to handle their special integrally silenced ammunition. Earliest prototypes featured new, very short smooth bore barrels"
* NO sights. None were needed. Low-light, use at close quarters, etc.
* Stubby, smooth-bore, almost non-existent barrel.
A firearm using uniquely developed INTERNALLY SILENCED AMMUNITION!!
"internally silenced ammunition, based on the "gas seal piston" concept . . . The whole concept of the internally silenced ammunition is rather old and starts in the pre-WW1 era, but practical results were achieved only during 1950s and 1960s, when chemical and metallurgical technologies finally permitted manufacture of actual ammunition."
A handgun NOT firing conventional ammunition. Firing tungsten balls from a sabot round!!
"the QSPR ammunition fired fifteen tungsten balls (loaded into plastic sabot)"
"the practical lethal range was estimated at about 30 feet / 10 meters, which was sufficient for extremely cramped tunnels of Vietnam war. The sound signature [report] of QSPR round fired from QSPR revolver was about 110 dB, or similar to that of traditionally silenced .22LR pistol."
AS WITH MOST, IF NOT ALL, "SILENCED" WEAPONRY, NOT TOTALLY SILENCED, BUT RATHER, MUFFLED!!
Was used to a very limited extent by special operations units in Vietnam, BUT NOT DURING TUNNEL OPERATIONS!!
These handguns, if they still exist, must be worth a lot of money. What happened to them in the aftermath of the war. You could not fire one as the ammo would not be available? Worth something to a collector, that would be for sure!
coolbert.
Saturday, November 1, 2008
Silent Sten
This is coolbert:
Here with a description of the silent Sten. British sub-machine gun from the World Two [WW2] era! AND REPUTEDLY CARRIED BY THE BRITISH SPECIAL BOAT SERVICE [SBS] FOR DECADES AFTERWARDS!!

A weapon ideally suited for special operations type missions. NOT so much a "silenced" weapon but rather MUFFLED!!?? Giving several distinct advantages to the user.
* Muffled report!
* Concealed muzzle flash!
"the gun could be used without alerting the enemy to small-arms fire in the vicinity. Only someone who was within 200 yards of the firer would be able to recognise the sound as gunfire. Another advantage of the silencer was that it eliminated any muzzle flash. This was important when the SOE team was operating at night. The sten gun silencer was an ideal weapon for assassination"
The "silent" Sten - - a sub-machine gun, wielded by Lt. Col. Ivan Lyon in a "last stand" situation. Lyon, commander of the Jaywick commando unit during Operation Rimau, killed during what became known as the Battle of Soreh Island.
"The Japanese returned two hours later, consisting of approximately 110 soldiers. For almost four hours, the Japanese suffered tremendous losses, unaware that their enemy was in fact firing from high above them"
"At midnight, Japanese soldiers finally caught sight of the tiny muzzle flashes from the Silent Stens. Grenades were thrown above the branches; Ross and Lyon fell down from the branches, killed by shrapnel. They had accounted for over sixty dead and wounded Japanese."
Again - - the silenced Sten was even used for DECADES following the end of WW2? Employed by the English special operations unit SBS [Special Boat Service]!?
"The SBS were known to still be using the Silent Sten as late as the 1982 Falklands conflict. At least one recon patrol that was landed on the islands is known to have carried the weapon with them."
Silence is golden? With a Sten, it could be!
coolbert.
Here with a description of the silent Sten. British sub-machine gun from the World Two [WW2] era! AND REPUTEDLY CARRIED BY THE BRITISH SPECIAL BOAT SERVICE [SBS] FOR DECADES AFTERWARDS!!
A weapon ideally suited for special operations type missions. NOT so much a "silenced" weapon but rather MUFFLED!!?? Giving several distinct advantages to the user.
* Muffled report!
* Concealed muzzle flash!
"the gun could be used without alerting the enemy to small-arms fire in the vicinity. Only someone who was within 200 yards of the firer would be able to recognise the sound as gunfire. Another advantage of the silencer was that it eliminated any muzzle flash. This was important when the SOE team was operating at night. The sten gun silencer was an ideal weapon for assassination"
The "silent" Sten - - a sub-machine gun, wielded by Lt. Col. Ivan Lyon in a "last stand" situation. Lyon, commander of the Jaywick commando unit during Operation Rimau, killed during what became known as the Battle of Soreh Island.
"The Japanese returned two hours later, consisting of approximately 110 soldiers. For almost four hours, the Japanese suffered tremendous losses, unaware that their enemy was in fact firing from high above them"
"At midnight, Japanese soldiers finally caught sight of the tiny muzzle flashes from the Silent Stens. Grenades were thrown above the branches; Ross and Lyon fell down from the branches, killed by shrapnel. They had accounted for over sixty dead and wounded Japanese."
Again - - the silenced Sten was even used for DECADES following the end of WW2? Employed by the English special operations unit SBS [Special Boat Service]!?
"The SBS were known to still be using the Silent Sten as late as the 1982 Falklands conflict. At least one recon patrol that was landed on the islands is known to have carried the weapon with them."
Silence is golden? With a Sten, it could be!
coolbert.
Wednesday, October 29, 2008
Silence!
This is coolbert:
Thanks to the Russian web site WorldGuns.
Here is a collection of silenced firearms - - the like of which would be carried and employed by ranger/commando/special operations units that perform direct action missions.
Direct action missions requiring stealth, surreptitious entry of a facility, the elimination of guards and sentries in a silent manner, etc.
Perhaps the word MUFFLED is more appropriate when speaking of "silenced" firearms? The report [the sound a firearm makes is called the "report"] is not totally eliminated with most silenced weapons [?], but is rather markedly reduced? This is more correct?
Silencers do have drawbacks that preclude widespread battlefield use! To include:
* Reduced effective range and "stopping power" of the firearm! ["stopping power" is especially critical with a handgun, ALL handguns being marginal stoppers to begin with!]
* A silencer, according to what I read, is effective for only about ten to twenty rounds max, and then loses all ability to "muffle" the report!
Here with a smattering of silenced military firearms, past and present:
* PB silenced pistol [Soviet/Russian].
Each and every Soviet/Russian spetsnaz soldier carries one of these pistols, strapped to his leg. Allow for the parachutist to defend himself immediately upon landing, his AK having been secured in a case prior to exiting the aircraft. A pistol that can be used in either the silenced or non-silenced mode!
"The PB (Pistolet Besshumnyj - Silenced Pistol), also known for Soviet/Russian army as 6P9, has been developed by 1967 for Spetsnaz elements of the Soviet army . . . The pistol is based on significantly modified Makarov PM pistol, and features an unique integral two-part silencer. The rear part of the silencer is fixed around the barrel, which is drilled to decrease the muzzle velocity below the speed of sound."


* Welrod silenced pistol [British].
"British World War Two [WW2] era silenced pistol. A bolt-action pistol [!!], originally of .32 caliber, used by special operations units even up until the 1990's!"

"[the]Welrod pistol was developed in UK by Special Operations Executive (S.O.E.), a government organisation which was tasked with intelligence, diversions and other special operations . . . 9mm Welrod Mk.I commenced in 1944, on request of the British Special operations forces. The latter model survived for a quite long time, and some 9mm Welrod Mk.I pistols were apparently still in operational use by British Special Operations forces as late as in 1991, during the operation Desert Storm.
* VSS silenced sniper rifle [Soviet/Russian].
Currently IN USE by Russian airborne and special operations [Spetsnaz] units. Effective range with integral silencer is about 200 meters.

"VSS (Vinovka Snaiperskaja Spetsialnaya = Special Sniper Rifle) was designed for special operations . . . [this weapon uses ] a new subsonic cartridge, based on the 7.62x39 case, necked out for 9mm bullet. The bullets used in new cartridges are long and heavy (about 16 gram), and of ball (SP-5) and AP (SP-6) type. The latter bullet features a hardened steel penetrator as the core, and can defeat most military issue body armors at ranges up to 300-400 meters." [this rifle is accurate out to about 200 meters]

The above photo taken this year, 2008. That young-looking Russian troop [either airborne or spetsnaz!] guarding those captured Georgian soldiers is carrying the VSS silenced sniper rifle.
* Sten - - Mk.II(S) [British].
A silenced version of the famous Sten gun. WW2 era sub-machine gun produced for a cost of about $8! THIS WEAPONS WAS CARRIED AND USED BY THE JAYWICK RAIDERS DURING THE ABORTIVE OPERATION RIMAU!

"Some Mk.II STEN guns were manufactured with integral silencers for undercover operations and were marked as These guns had shortened barrels enclosed into integral silencer. The silencer was rather effective so most audible sound when firing Mk.IIS was the clattering of the bolt moving back and forth in the receiver."
* De Lisle Carbine (De Lisle Silenced Carbine) [British].
This was an interesting prototype [?] weapon that may have been used by the troops of the Long Range Desert Group [LRDG]! A modified British SMLE rifle with integral silencer, firing the .45 caliber ACP pistol round!

"the De Lisle carbine was invented by William De Lisle. The weapon is a combination of the modified SMLE bolt, receiver, and stock mated to a shortened Thompson submachine barrel. The magazine housing and the bolt’s face has been adapted to accept the 7 round magazine for the Colt M1911a1 pistol . . . An integral sound suppressor is fitted to the carbine and ran the full length of the barrel and then several inches beyond."
"The .45 ACP round was selected because it is a subsonic round . . . The 45 ACP was ideal because it retains close to its full lethality even with a suppressor."
[and the LRDG too carried as a standard [?] weapon the Thompson .45 ACP sub-machine gun! You would have a commonality of ammunition here. An important consideration for special operations units?]
"A primary use for the carbine was to kill radio operators, high value targets (leaders) and sentries when conducting raids or planting explosives on airfields or other important targets."
Exactly! As I have said: "direct action missions requiring stealth, surreptitious entry [penetration] of a facility [airbase]"!
coolbert.
Thanks to the Russian web site WorldGuns.
Here is a collection of silenced firearms - - the like of which would be carried and employed by ranger/commando/special operations units that perform direct action missions.
Direct action missions requiring stealth, surreptitious entry of a facility, the elimination of guards and sentries in a silent manner, etc.
Perhaps the word MUFFLED is more appropriate when speaking of "silenced" firearms? The report [the sound a firearm makes is called the "report"] is not totally eliminated with most silenced weapons [?], but is rather markedly reduced? This is more correct?
Silencers do have drawbacks that preclude widespread battlefield use! To include:
* Reduced effective range and "stopping power" of the firearm! ["stopping power" is especially critical with a handgun, ALL handguns being marginal stoppers to begin with!]
* A silencer, according to what I read, is effective for only about ten to twenty rounds max, and then loses all ability to "muffle" the report!
Here with a smattering of silenced military firearms, past and present:
* PB silenced pistol [Soviet/Russian].
Each and every Soviet/Russian spetsnaz soldier carries one of these pistols, strapped to his leg. Allow for the parachutist to defend himself immediately upon landing, his AK having been secured in a case prior to exiting the aircraft. A pistol that can be used in either the silenced or non-silenced mode!
"The PB (Pistolet Besshumnyj - Silenced Pistol), also known for Soviet/Russian army as 6P9, has been developed by 1967 for Spetsnaz elements of the Soviet army . . . The pistol is based on significantly modified Makarov PM pistol, and features an unique integral two-part silencer. The rear part of the silencer is fixed around the barrel, which is drilled to decrease the muzzle velocity below the speed of sound."


* Welrod silenced pistol [British].
"British World War Two [WW2] era silenced pistol. A bolt-action pistol [!!], originally of .32 caliber, used by special operations units even up until the 1990's!"

"[the]Welrod pistol was developed in UK by Special Operations Executive (S.O.E.), a government organisation which was tasked with intelligence, diversions and other special operations . . . 9mm Welrod Mk.I commenced in 1944, on request of the British Special operations forces. The latter model survived for a quite long time, and some 9mm Welrod Mk.I pistols were apparently still in operational use by British Special Operations forces as late as in 1991, during the operation Desert Storm.
* VSS silenced sniper rifle [Soviet/Russian].
Currently IN USE by Russian airborne and special operations [Spetsnaz] units. Effective range with integral silencer is about 200 meters.

"VSS (Vinovka Snaiperskaja Spetsialnaya = Special Sniper Rifle) was designed for special operations . . . [this weapon uses ] a new subsonic cartridge, based on the 7.62x39 case, necked out for 9mm bullet. The bullets used in new cartridges are long and heavy (about 16 gram), and of ball (SP-5) and AP (SP-6) type. The latter bullet features a hardened steel penetrator as the core, and can defeat most military issue body armors at ranges up to 300-400 meters." [this rifle is accurate out to about 200 meters]

The above photo taken this year, 2008. That young-looking Russian troop [either airborne or spetsnaz!] guarding those captured Georgian soldiers is carrying the VSS silenced sniper rifle.
* Sten - - Mk.II(S) [British].
A silenced version of the famous Sten gun. WW2 era sub-machine gun produced for a cost of about $8! THIS WEAPONS WAS CARRIED AND USED BY THE JAYWICK RAIDERS DURING THE ABORTIVE OPERATION RIMAU!

"Some Mk.II STEN guns were manufactured with integral silencers for undercover operations and were marked as These guns had shortened barrels enclosed into integral silencer. The silencer was rather effective so most audible sound when firing Mk.IIS was the clattering of the bolt moving back and forth in the receiver."
* De Lisle Carbine (De Lisle Silenced Carbine) [British].
This was an interesting prototype [?] weapon that may have been used by the troops of the Long Range Desert Group [LRDG]! A modified British SMLE rifle with integral silencer, firing the .45 caliber ACP pistol round!

"the De Lisle carbine was invented by William De Lisle. The weapon is a combination of the modified SMLE bolt, receiver, and stock mated to a shortened Thompson submachine barrel. The magazine housing and the bolt’s face has been adapted to accept the 7 round magazine for the Colt M1911a1 pistol . . . An integral sound suppressor is fitted to the carbine and ran the full length of the barrel and then several inches beyond."
"The .45 ACP round was selected because it is a subsonic round . . . The 45 ACP was ideal because it retains close to its full lethality even with a suppressor."
[and the LRDG too carried as a standard [?] weapon the Thompson .45 ACP sub-machine gun! You would have a commonality of ammunition here. An important consideration for special operations units?]
"A primary use for the carbine was to kill radio operators, high value targets (leaders) and sentries when conducting raids or planting explosives on airfields or other important targets."
Exactly! As I have said: "direct action missions requiring stealth, surreptitious entry [penetration] of a facility [airbase]"!
coolbert.
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